You're Not Born Talented w/ Gilad Bogner

Jeff Albaum

Okay, yeah, yeah. Now it's working. Now it's working. Now it's working. You're good. All right. yeah, yeah. Hashtag be better. sweet. All right, I'm gonna do my intro. Three, two, one, go. What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to another episode of Curiosity Class. Today we have the one, the only Gilad Bogner, better known as Bogey on Spotify, YouTube, Apple Music, Amazon.

Gilad

Yeah. We're gonna ask it to be better.

Jeff Albaum

iHeartRadio, et cetera. Gilad, welcome. Thank you for being here.

Gilad

And Napst and Napster. If anyone remembers what Napster is in Limewire. Yeah. There used to be some good ones. Like it used to be like a like it used to be a social status kind of thing. I th I think there are still people encamped in the Spotify and and Apple music camps and the occasional like I do YouTube music. But there used to be like a a religion to it.

Jeff Albaum

And and lime wire. Or just kidding. Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Well, I yeah. Can you can you admit now publicly to ever having illegally downloaded music, or even as a kid, you were like, That's not my vibe.

Gilad

No. Like jokes aside, I it's not that I like I'm not I don't pirate music. I don't need to. It's so accessible on streaming platforms. But a great example is I was in the studio a while not too long ago and I was tracking a young singer and for like just recreational purposes and just to get her voice warmed up warmed up, I asked like what what song do you like to sing?

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Gilad

And I just like literally downloaded the song into the DAW, the the recording software. And I removed the vocals so that she could sing over it. And like technically it's probably not super legal. But that being said, I'm being paid, I think it's a I I I if I'm not mistaken, I think it's a third of a penny per stream. It's like it's fine. It's fine.

Jeff Albaum

Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I still I I agree. It it is interesting to think like back in the day you would have to the way like you had to pay a dollar twenty nine or ninety-nine cents per song. And yeah, to your point, like it's crazy. Now music is so ex like there isn't a song that you can't hear if you want to, if you have internet.

Gilad

Yeah. But that's another thing. Like people people who like kind of shit on the streaming industry and say like, well, it doesn't pay musicians. Being able to listen to music that wasn't being played live in front of you or by you is is a is a hundred and fifty year old privilege, right? There wasn't a record player earlier than that. And which is why com like it used to be a communal event or it used to be a cultural event to see someone playing music.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And the reason you went out to do it is because you couldn't do it in your home. And now it's that that cultural communal thing has been ta has bec has become so private that most people listen to most of the music that they listen to in their car by themselves or on the subway in headphones or like every everyone like it's dir it's like a commute thing to keep them from being present, which is the opposite of what like if if you're at a live show, being present is what you wanna be.

Jeff Albaum

Right, right.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

It's like it so it's completely shifted. So I I've never like had like first of all, life is what it like it is what it is. Like streaming's gonna pay me a a third of a penny. It's just the world I have to navigate and I have to figure out other ways to, you know, to make money as a musician, which which which again just brings me back to the original way people made money as musicians, which is performing. It's it's as simple as that. so I I I kind of like roll my eyes at the

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

People who are super critical of the streaming industry that come from outside of it. I can understand someone saying like I'm leaving millions of dollars on the table by not collecting more of what I produced, which that I can understand, but like if that's not the case, like whatever.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. What what are the economics of shows? Like how does that work? Did do musicians get paid by the venue or is it by the like how how does that work?

Gilad

Yeah.

So it it's it it depends what stage you're at, and where you where you are, because for someone at my level here in the States or even specifically au in Austin, Texas, there are a couple options. You can get, you know, a venue can commission you to come and play a two, three hour set, like a bar.

Then you're the background music and they're gonna pay you a flat fee and you're gonna use that flat fee to pay your musicians whatever agreed upon amount you've been paying them. You can like if you wanna put on a ticketed show, which I think is the best, and ticketed doesn't always mean it costs money, but it means that the only reason people are showing up is because you told them to. Meaning, like, I I'm putting on a album release show or I'm putting on just a regular, like, hey, I'm coming to Austin and I'm putting on a show and I'm gonna reach out to everyone I know, whether on social media,

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

SMS or through marketing channels and and encourage people to come to my show. And when when they come to my show, they know that they're coming to see Bogey playing a show. That's ticketed. And it can or cannot cost money. I I've I've I'm leaning more these days into a donation-based ticketed system because people who can't afford to pay for a ticket, even if it is ten dollars. And I've been there and there are days when I'm still there where where ten dollars is just like it it might be a bit much, it's like

you you're thinking to yourself, because of the money, do I want to or do I not want to? So I want to let those people be at the show. And usually when I do things that are donation based, like I made merch, handmade merch. People who wanted to buy the merch paid way above what it cost me to make the merch. Someone hand me like a fifty dollar bill for a t shirt. And I and he was like, is this enough? I was like, Yeah, it's fine. Thrifted a t shirt

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And and screen printed it by hand, which is very much aligned with like what I do. Like I love thrifting and I love being like artistic, and it was a it's a logo that my sister made. And but that's more testament to the fact that like that person has $50 and he wants to give them to me, and now he has an excuse to. He wants to invest in the show that he just enjoyed watching and he wants to see it do well.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And now he's showing a vote of confidence and inve and emotion emotional and financial investment in that thing that made him feel good or feel something. Because sometimes my songs don't make people feel good. Maybe they make them feel heard. But so the economics. So I'll I'll make it really simple. When the Beatles were touring, and the reason they had a privilege, I don't know if you know this, but the Beatles eventually stopped touring.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

was the model was you tour to promote records, record sales being the most profitable thing because you're selling something physical, right? B there which means that there's a baseline, cost per album to make. And then you start thinking to yourself, all right, how much do I have to bring in because of how much it costs me to make it and still turn a profit? Which puts things in very quantifiable,

Jeff Albaum

Okay.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Numbers and figures. in the early 2000s, Steve Jobs kind of confronts a lot of the record labels and and tells him it's like there's a new day around the corner. Like these C D things are not gonna last forever. This is at the like during the time of CDs. we had already gone through small cassette tapes and we had already gone through like different variations of vinyl records. And Steve Jobs looks at the

record companies and says, your day is n is nearing an end and you might as well partner up with me because it's all going to be done online. The first, and still existing by the way to this day, iTunes, the fact that you can buy, legally buy a song, you can still do that by the way. You can still use iTunes and purchase music. And then you have the right to do with it things that you don't have the right to do with streaming. Then

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Then you have streaming, which came out a little bit later. there were different variations of it before like the the true like powerhouses really settled into place. But now you you have people playing paying, you know, twenty I don't know what it is exactly, but twenty thirty dollar monthly subscriptions and having access to every single song that is released digitally on planet Earth. And that's not profitable.

So basically it turned the music industry on its head. And now people release albums so that they can go on tour and profit from shows. Now there are other ways to profit from music. There are there are brand deals. There are sync licenses where where like someone reached out reached out to me a few months ago and asked if she could use her use one of my songs for she she was in something called Fringe Festival in LA. Have you ever heard of that?

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Yeah, yeah. I don't know why, but yeah, I have.

Gilad

It's like it's a it's it's like a theater festival. And I she reached out to me and said that she had kind of come across my music and that she'd like to use it for the opening and closing credits of her show. That's a sync deal where someone uses my song for commercial purposes and pays me a either a flat fee. We we can agree on a flat fee, we can agree on a royalty, we can agree on a split.

Meaning like if the movie does well, how much of the movies royalties do I get because my songs were the opening? That that's a great example. This being like an an indie artist, you know, really I would I don't know how early in her career she is, but she kinda made it clear that this was kind of boot like gr grassroots ground up energy. And I was just so I was just so honored that someone wanted to like use my music. I was like, do it.

Jeff Albaum

Sure, sure.

Gilad

I'll send you the original files. Like you don't have to download it. Like tell if there's any help like anything I can do to save you time. and she was like, Really? You mean I like I I was like, I don't know what she was expecting, but I was definitely not gonna be the person who's gonna be like, No, you can't use my song if you're not paying

Jeff Albaum

Yeah, yeah. That's so cool, dude.

Gilad

It was a cool experience.

Jeff Albaum

Did you

What how old were you when you first found out, or when you first realized that you were like, This is what I want to do? Like, I want to be a musician.

Gilad

So there are a couple there are a couple really like w as you're asking a question, I'm I'm not gonna answer the only answer that I usually answer. I'm gonna answer a couple other things that came to mind as you were as you were asking it. The

Jeff Albaum

Try.

Fuck.

It's always at the best part.

not gonna give the answer you usually give. I'm gonna say a couple of the other things that comes to mind.

Gilad

That came to mind. we left off where you asked me, what where like if there were a couple, if there was a place where I knew that this was something that I was going to do. so I was very lucky. My dad was a part-time musician when we were living in the States. for those who know me, they know, but for those who don't, we moved to Israel when I was seven years old from the states. And my dad, when we were living in the states, was a part-time musician. He plays trombone.

the the closure and like the the the cool thing that happens at the other side of this is that as a twenty eight year old recording my debut album, my dad was in the studio recording trombones for my songs, which was like, and he's the one who really educated me musically. so when we were really young, my sister and I, it would be like kind of a treat that my dad would take us to see his shows. And he

Some sometimes he would even have us like sitting on stage next to him, which looking back is very awkward. But like it's such like as a kid, you're like sitting there with all that excitement. And my dad, who is a well was really well spoken guy and like obvious like very I wouldn't say he's super outgoing, but he's like an easy guy to talk to. just like his his Riz game would like quadruple on stage. Just like he would he would become this exciting creature that

And like we're talking about a guy who was like at the time overweight, bald, religious orthodox Jew. And it's like he made everyone kind of like melt. And like it's it's like it's a contradiction. And it was just because he was so in the moment and and enjoyed himself so much. That's something that I later understood. But at the at the time it was just like this guy who's usually pretty serious and does have a sense of humor, but like he's dad.

He's he's the guy who tells me what I can and cannot do and and punishes me when I when I mess up. Suddenly I see this same guy with a trumbone. If you know it, that it has like this long thing that you that you like pull in and out, like using that to like poke people that are walking by the stage as they're like next. Like just like this playful energy that that I didn't that I didn't see to that extent. And I was like, this is for me. I remember him introducing me to their guitarist.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And I was like, that he's like, You want to touch my electric guitar? I was like, Yeah. And I like, and that was like me falling in love. By the time I was like five or six, my dad had me and my sister both in piano lessons. and I I didn't take it seriously, but I was just good at it. Like I heard what I like I heard well. I was really good at at at remembering things and mimicking what the teacher would do. I was miserable.

at sight reading. I never was good at like reading notes or anything like that. Another thing that comes to mind, and this I don't know I I I've asked my mom about this and she's kind of played it off a couple times, is I remember when we were moving to Israel, she my parents were naturally worried about me. Kid in a new like a sensitive kid, new environment and Israel, like Israeli culture, especially Israeli religious culture, is very like rough around the edges.

And American culture is like I feel like especially in in in structured environments like school or after school activities, here in the States it's very much an effort of the people on behalf of the structure, to make it less rough around the edge and make it easier for the kids who are less popular. You know, like in Israel, it's like what you guys do in recess is up to you. I'm gonna be here teaching the class when you get back. not not really as a saying, but just like as a fact of life.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

and I so and I wasn't doing well as a s I was never a good student, neither in school nor nor in music. And I think my mom was like trying to have me checked out for like learning disabilities would be my best guest. if not, you know, like she she may have thought that there was something going on with me. And she I remember her talking to the doctor and saying, like, it's crazy when he's listen when I when he's singing songs.

Jeff Albaum

Right, right.

Gilad

He's singing the entire song, not just the parts that are that are singing. He like, if there's a break in the singing, he'll like he'll be the guitar, he'll be the drums, and he'll do them all somehow at the same time. And I remember like I was like, Wait, that's not how most people do this. Like when you're singing, like like I sing the the song. And if there's a part where there's no vocals and there's no singing, then I'll like sing the the bass line or I'll sing the like and I'll like I'll make

Something something exists there so that it's a continuous thing. And when she said that, that was kind of like, okay, that's cool to know that I like that didn't that most people don't do that. in Israel, there's a mandatory military draft. So after I was done with high school, I went into the army, into a combat unit, which was very which is very much like celebrated in my neck of the woods. You know, like the modern Orthodox Israeli scene is very like pro enlistment, pro going into meaningful units so that you can have a meaningful service.

but that meant that music was very much on the back burner. And when I got out four years later, I was definitely rusty and my ex and I were traveling in South America and she kinda convinced me, she's like, Maybe you should get a guitar, you know, like bat we'll backpack with a guitar. She's like and I I was like, Cool, yeah. And I bought this like twenty dollar guitar in Peru, this tiny little like backpacker guitar, and I fell back in love with it. And by the time we had gotten back to Israel a few months later, I was like, I I

I had kind of made up my mind that I'm gonna sign up for Remon, which is like one of the one of the well regarded music schools in Israel. I think I had yet to dare to like dream big at the time I was I was enrolling as just a guitarist. And when I say just, it's like it's just like any other business. You have the entrepreneurs, you have the people, the visionaries, and you have like the the the the hired guns. You know, like you have the the sound you have the sound engineers, you have the you have the on stage musicians, you have the

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Producers, and you have the artists where like the way I look at it is that like they have to be the entrepreneurs, they have to be the visionaries, the ones that are creating something that no one else is creating. A producer might have to fit into that box as well. But you know, like a guitarist or a drummer is like they're they're they're nine times out of ten, they're gonna be someone else's employee. And then you have like these obvious like

godly talents who can draw a crowd just by playing the drums. And they do exist. Like they're in the musicians' realm, there's like there are names like Victor Wooten, who's known for being a bass player. There's Nate Smith who plays with Wolfpeck and and you play Alabama Shakes, who he he's known for being a drummer. And when he's brought on to someone else's gig as a drummer, people are coming, maybe not as much for him as for the performer, but people are coming to see him just as much.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

So so I feel like that's how it kind of splits up. I stayed in music school for like a year. I was like, this is not for me. also because I started to realize how much I had missed songwriting and singing, and I was there as a guitarist, which I definitely got better as, but I was also realizing like, okay, I could spend this time writing as opposed to playing scales, or at least some of it writing as opposed to getting ready for my, you know, end of semester jazz.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

exam, you know? Like I I I I started to understand better through other people's eyes and through my own who I am as a musician and what I truly enjoy.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

And how how old were you at this time? This cause you said this after the army, but you had also traveled already, so you were like twenty three, give or take?

Gilad

After the army. Yeah. Yeah, I got out of the army when I was twenty two twenty two. No. I got out of the army when I was almost twenty f twenty four. So I so w I I went into music school when I was like twenty four and a half, probably. Yeah. About that. I finished music school one year later. I was I I had had enough. I probably d I don't even think I f I finished

Jeff Albaum

Okay.

Okay.

Gilad

the second half of the first year. saved up my pennies, moved to New York, hated New York, went to Mexico to wash New York off. And then someone was like, You should go to Austin. You're a musician. So I did.

I ha I hated New I hated New York so much. Everything was wrong with my life in I was born in well, yeah, that's where the the biggest factory for for drew making is.

Jeff Albaum

But you were born there, right?

Yeah.

Gilad

Where the that's where the product line is. like actually, like there are more Jews in Brooklyn than there are in Jerusalem, which is a phenomenal statistic, if you ever but I was born there, we lived in Connecticut, but everything was wrong with my life when I was in New York. Like I was still I had I'd kind of figured out who what I want to do, but it's the same as saying, like, I I realized that I want to have a s a tech startup. It's like

Jeff Albaum

Right. Right.

Gilad

That's so vague. I still didn't understand who I was as a writer. I had I had yet to get through enough songs written to have an idea of, you know, like like what color artist are you? Are you orange? Are you pink? You know, like like what what what what do what do you feel? What do you make people feel? Why would people relate to you? And I had just like I was just like, I want people to relate to me. But like I didn't I didn't yet maybe understand why.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And I imagine it will always be an evolving why, but at that point I didn't even have like a little bit of a why.

Jeff Albaum

When when did you st so now looking back obviously because again, like you said, it's probably evolving, but like when do you think you've first had a definitive why?

Gilad

I think the first definitive why happened here in Austin, Texas, where so we we were talking about like different kinds of shows of people who are like really getting started in their career, you'll find them playing a lot of like especially in genres that are, you know, that that warrant a a singer songwriter with a guitar. You know, like I'm I'm sh I'm guessing you're not gonna see a lot of trap rap artists at cafes. But a lot of people with like acoustic guitars are just keyboards.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Gilad

We'll play like cafe shows or or local bar shows and and like just a get the mileage in, you know, like there there is a lot to be said for being comfortable on stage, in front of an unfavorable audience or even an audience that didn't know you were there when they came to see you. Like they they may have just been coming for their cup of beer or coffee. so that's a good experience. So I was playing a show at Mozart's here in Austin, and I finished the show and someone came up to me.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And talk to me about a song, she was sobbing, first of all, and kind of just like gave me her entire life story.

And like the the sad parts, not like not not the good stuff, like the my dad just passed away. I feel so alone in the world. and at the beginning I thought that my music was just kind of supposed to be a warm hug, but I also write happy songs. Like I not a lot of them, but like I also write upbeat songs and it was like, Well, what about those songs? And I f I feel like nowadays

Jeff Albaum

Yeah, yeah.

Gilad

And this has actually been said to me. And there have been a lot of similar occurrences since, but like I feel like the underlying tone of what people relate to my music through is feeling heard. People feel understood. You know, like I'm w I I always joke around the fact that s my some of my sadder songs are the s and by the way, the ones that I genuinely like singing more is it kind of allows it

Me to get that like funk out of my system. If I'm feeling alone and I write a song about feeling alone, I can then observe being alone and I am no longer alone because I'm standing outside of alone looking in. So I think that I think that that's something that people come to my music for. w w w when they do it consciously, think that's what they're doing, they're doing it for. And if they kind of bump into my music, that that'll usually be what draws them in.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Wow. Did you that's crazy. I've never I think growing up, obviously, like I I would listen to music in a more surface level way, right? Like I think like most kids or teenagers, you like you listen to a song and you're like, I don't know why I like it. I just like it or I don't like it, whatever. and one of my best friend, but like I remember my one of my best friends in high school said something once and he was like, Yeah, I like music that makes me feel.

Gilad

But that's a beauty. That's the beauty.

Jeff Albaum

And was like, what? Like, what do you what do you mean? He's like, Yeah, it doesn't actually have to be like it doesn't matter how it makes me feel. I just like music that makes me feel. And I've always thought about that since as like a yeah, it is really interesting. I I I probably wouldn't have put those words together myself, but hearing it, it like really resonated with me. I was like, Yeah, okay, for sure. And then you look back at the songs that you do like and you're like, Yeah, they make me feel insert thing here, right? But it always is. it makes me feel. and so I thought that was pretty insightful.

Gilad

I w I'm I'm listening for the third time, to a probably my most revisited book ever. Like I'm not a huge reader, so for me to be reading or listening to I read it once and and listened a couple of times, but for me to be circling back to a book is is a pretty big deal. Twelve rules for life by Jordan Peterson.

Jeff Albaum

Mm, okay.

Gilad

And he talks about he he he uses a lot of different terms, but he like uses the the yin and yang symbol as a great like he compares them to the masculine and feminine, the black serpent with the white eye being you know, the masculine, the order, the the structure, the the confidence, the all all all these things that we associate with masculine nature or with order.

and the and and the white snake or the white serpent with the black eye being the feminine. And it's not Jordan Peterson who makes that comparison. It's that that it's that's Taoism, basically. but he he points it out and he talks about the fact that the black eye in the white serpent and the white eye in the black serpent are in fact like between chaos and order between masculine and feminine, those those

Jeff Albaum

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Right. All right.

Gilad

The the those those things are the meaning of life. And that's why music he and use I I'm paraphrasing terribly, so don't hold me accountable for this exact quote. But he talks about the fact that music is the exact balance between a lot of chaotic things, both predicta predictable and unpredictable, harmoniously creating something that makes the meaning of like of life echo from within you. And sometimes the meaning of life is and this is

close the paraphrase. Sometimes the meaning of life is sorrow. Sometimes the meaning of life is absolute joy and bliss. and all of those things can be brought out by music. I've always listened to music in in a in a in a different way, the same way a mechanic hears a car engine a different way. Because I grew up around musicians as a musician, I've always like been listening to like the if a mechanic listens to a car, he he he'll tell you if it

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

you know, how soon it needs oil, if it needs to be checked. When I'm listening to to an album, I was just talking to a friend about this. I'm at the beginning it was me just like separating layers. It was like now I hear the bass, now I hear the drums, now I hear like me kind of like being able to sing arrangement parts. At this point, after like recording spending quite a bit of time in the studio, it's already to the point where like I am picturing how s how straight or how slouched the drummer is when he's playing.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And I'm picturing how like choked up the bass player is on his chest with the bass, like how tight he has the strap. Like that's like that's where what what like what I feel like I'm listening to these days. And I sometimes get it wrong, but like I'm as

Jeff Albaum

Is that is that is that fun? Like what when when you think about that, like or is that is that just like the nitty gritty, like you're just so in it?

Gilad

I'm so in it. So in it. Yeah. It's it's not I don't know any other way. Like I it's been forever since I don't remember myself listening to music and just being like, hmm, this song is is fun or this song is like I remember listening, my aunt used to take my sister and I in the car and listen to Octopus's Bar Garden by the Beatles.

Jeff Albaum

Dude, that's crazy.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

I would ask anyone to sing Octopus's Garden. They'd start with, you know, like the the lyric, the first lyric that comes into the song, probably like twenty seconds in, which is I'd like to be under the sea. When I would sing that song, I would start from the guitar lick. And when the drums come in, I would bang next to like the the like I would sing all twenty seconds leading up to like when the so it was something that I was clearly being

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Gilad

primed to in the most positive sense by my surroundings.

Jeff Albaum

Do you think you would have come to it if you hadn't grown up with with that priming?

Gilad

We will we we will never know. I I I think people people I I'd rather think not. And I'll tell you why. I think it's a more hopeful hopeful hopeful thought th that I wouldn't have kind of found it by myself because a lot of people are like, you're so lucky you have this genetic thing where you're like you're musical, you're genet like you're genetically

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Okay.

Okay.

Mm.

Gilad

made for this. And in general, I'm not a huge fan of the idea of, you know, like us being just a a bag of jeans. but also like I think that that it's so much more beautiful that I fell in love with music and was able to relate to it through the excitement that I watched my dad have. And like some of my best times growing up and even when I go back to Israel when when when my dad and I are in the car in the car.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

It turns into this exciting of like, you've gotta listen to this, and we'll put on music and we'll be like listening. And he's like, I like the harmonies where they're up there and like, can you hear the drummer? Like, like that's part of it. And that's so much of the enthusiasm. And I'd rather it come from there and a shared experience and a beautiful story that can be, you know, redone over generations. Like, if if we knew if if that if if what I'm saying is true.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

then the same excitement can be applied for mathematics and the same excitement can be applied for for literature, meaning that you're not born with what you're good at. You are only conditioned for what you're good at.

Jeff Albaum

Right. But I think it's interesting that you call that more hopeful because in in a certain sense it it it is more hopeful and that you're right, it you're not the the cards aren't dealt when you're born, but the cards are kind of dealt throughout your childhood and your upbringing. Right. Like

Gilad

Yes and yes and no, but but people like I got into fitness way out of my childhood. I was an active I was an active kid. I loved playing basketball. I loved playing soccer. I did a lot of sports, but the idea of the discipline and the mileage and and going for runs even in in rough weather and

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

was it was not only not part of my life, it was a it was a foreign term. Who are those crazy people? Gonna go sweat in their own like you're gonna go pay to sweat? What are you talking about? And and now like I'm so thankful that I have that practice in my life. Like it's it's it's a core like it's almost a core value of mine. And I only came I came I only came to know it in my mid twenties.

Jeff Albaum

Right.

Sure, that that's fair. But I think that in particular, fitness is a little bit of a unique one because it's a it's a one of those things that you can pick up. Pardon?

Gilad

Understand what you mean.

I no I do I I do understand what you mean. Like it also is like one of those unique things that like we primarily are like actually like built for. Like us being able to do hard things physically is like kinda what our body's made for. I can give you other examples, but like but yeah, like I I have guitar students who started playing in their thirties and they're excellent. Excellent. I don't think they're going to I don't think any of them have the draw to like make a career out of it. Or I don't think any like

Jeff Albaum

Yeah, yeah.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

But like I I I see people who are not pushed to it. And I also have guitar students who are kids whose parents are not musicians and have nothing to do with music. And they're just music consumers. And, you know, like what probably the most incredible student I've ever had I have right now, he's like eleven or twelve. I I I I envision the days not too far out where I'm like, I don't know, I don't I don't have much else to give you. He he's that good.

He's really good. And I'm like I know I never credited myself as like this phenomenal guitarist. But like I have like twenty years of playing the guitar. So like that's like there's a lot there's a lot to like just kind of share with people. This kid is phenomenal. Is phenomenal and he's twelve.

Jeff Albaum

That's pretty cool. Yeah, I think I think talent is well, d do you b like because obviously that that kid probably has talent, right? So like

Gilad

Yeah.

Yeah, but I think that more than his talent, because it's not his ear him specifically, it's his ears aren't the driver. Like his ears are the driver in the sense that he enjoys music, but he's not one of these kids who hears his mistakes. Like his mistakes still have to be pointed out to him. And he's definitely getting there because ear training is a is a real thing. So like you learn to hear your mistakes, you learn to hear things that are unique. It's his curiosity. Like this kid goes on seven hour YouTube rabbit holes.

Jeff Albaum

Okay.

Mm.

Gilad

And finds these bands that nobody's ever heard of, that nobody's ever heard of, and learns to play their riffs. It's it's very it's very unique. So with him I think it's specific curiosity was the way in.

Jeff Albaum

All about guitar.

Wow. I

Yeah. That that to me is what I think the best part. I don't know, like I love I think I'm very much an optimist by nature, but or maybe by primal childhood surroundings. but I think like one of the maybe both, yeah. I think like that's the coolest thing about living in twenty twenty six is like you can just if you have an internet connection, you can learn anything.

Gilad

Maybe both.

Jeff Albaum

A neat thing. You can follow people who are the most interested in beekeeping and you can learn everything about beekeeping and you can become an expert in beekeeping over the course of 30 hours. And like that just f like I I that fires me up. I don't know why, but it does.

Gilad

It's it it is there there's a price to it.

Th like I I do agree. I'm not like a pessimist in any way. And I I I I a hundred percent agree. that it's so cool that like I if I'm like even now as a as a guitarist, like I try to learn new things increasingly complex so that I can, you know, keep getting better. And it's sometimes really helpful to be able to just be like, hmm, what are the chords for Dream a Little Dream of of me? You know? Like to just pull up to pull up and then to create new chord inversions for them based on what I'm what I'm seeing.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

That being said, it makes it all that much more di like Jimi Hendrix picked up the guitar and didn't know he was playing it wrong until he was Jimi Hendrix. Right? He was left handed. His dad used to you know, beat him over the side of the head, like true story. Beat him like beat him because like left handed people were the devil's work. So you had to play your your guitar like a right handed person.

And he never knew he was doing anything wrong. He just did what was, you know, what felt natural to him. And there will never be another Jimi Hendrix. And I think that the more accessible immediate help is, it's like w where people are kind of drawn away from navigating the unknown. It's like, okay, less and less chance that you're gonna have these absolute freaks of nature. Or or or not you're gonna have less of them. It's just like

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Some of them may be missed. Like some of these people who may have stumbled upon their talent are now gonna be asking Chat GPT what to do to excite themselves, you know, or going to be instead of trying to ear train themselves to learn the chords for Desperado by the Eagles and coming up with rather than just the chords, the the idea behind the song, or an entirely new interpretation of the song.

They're gonna get a watered down ultimate guitar dot com version.

Jeff Albaum

But I but I feel like the the it's it's it's both, right? Like, yeah, for for sure it's a double edged sword. I'm not

Gilad

It's both. Yeah, no no. It's not neither or.

Yeah. No, i it it it's for sure both. And I and I'm as someone who uses the tools quite often, like I'm very grateful for them. I think that the thing to be cautious of is like I I'd prefer my students, like as a good as a music teacher, often you have you have these tools that you can use to in the class, you know, like a metronome that you'd pull up on your phone or a guitar tuner that you can pull up on your phone.

Jeff Albaum

Wait, what'd you say?

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And you can pull up the chords on your phone. And more often than not, I'd rather have my students play without a metronome, without a tuner, even, if it means that their phone is out of the room. Like I I I'm like, I think the best example for this is even like tuning your guitar. Is like now you have like a tuning app. I remember that like for me to tune a guitar.

Jeff Albaum

Mm. Mm.

Gilad

There was this like thing that just like it didn't show you what note you were hitting. It would only show you were if you were on the right note. Meaning it's not like, a little flat, a little sharp. It was like if it's an E. And if it's not an E, then you're not like then you're like we're not telling you what it is. Like that's what it was just like this old like 80s tuner that was with that was in my mom's guitar case. And she just had a guitar. And therefore, like I learned all these unique ways.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Gilad

Which which didn't seem super unique to me to tune the guitar. And through that I actually gained an incredible understanding, A of the guitar and B of my ears. Like I had to really learn to trust my ears and be like, is this guitar in tune? And some and to the point where now I'll use the the phone tuner to tune the guitar, then I'll turn the tuner the tuner off and ask my ears, does this sound good to me? And sometimes the answer is no and I have to finish it off with my ears.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And that's a that that's a that's a great place to be as a musician. And the same goes again, and the same goes for like a mechanic. If we had an app, and I'm sure we do, that you could put your phone next to an engine and you'd and someone would run the engine and it would diagnose the engine, on one hand, yeah, that would make the mechanic's job a little bit easier. On the other hand, it would make the need for a mechanic a lot less.

Jeff Albaum

Mm, interesting.

Gilad

And it would make his expertise much and it would make his expertise much mess much less meaningful, also.

Jeff Albaum

For sure, but like

For sure. For sure. Yes. And you you could have said the same thing about cars when cars came out, right? Like, but then the need for horse drawn carriage repair people are their expertise is going to go down, right? So it's like this, but then you have cars, which like this whole other thing. And so I don't know. I I do I I I don't want to say like naively, that's so there's only positives, there's for sure negatives. but I don't know. I

Gilad

Yeah, and I'm and I'm not looking at it as a as a net negative or positive. That's not that like that wasn't me going like, yeah, but we were better off without it. Like definitely like we were just talking about streaming and it's like I am definitely of the like I see the pros of streaming, the fact that I can access so much inspiration and so much variety. You know, like I it's it's happened to me before where I've been writing a song. I've been like, I want to change something about this. And I'll literally go on Spotify.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Right.

Gilad

And I'll like look through and I'll be like, I'll go through an artist and I'll be like, this feels like super unrelated to the song that I'm writing. Let's see what kind of drums he's using. And then I'll just get a drum idea from his song. Completely unrelated to the song. That doesn't exist without streaming. But I'm I'm just saying the flip the flip side of that. And by the way, I'm the last person who's gonna be like, we need to limit like anything that's gonna better humanity. Don't limit it. Don't limit it. Like, like

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Our need for humans will will always exist. I I'm a firm believer in that. Like one job replaced is another two jobs, you know, created. It might not be the exact equation, but like, you know, people thought the assembly line would, you know, put half a generation out of work. And it didn't. And we always our needs evolve just the same way that our, you know, that that that our environment evolves, or the way we make our environment evolve.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah, totally. Totally.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I I once heard you say on a podcast, actually. And I don't know if this if I understood this to be, if I understood this correctly, but this this was this was how I understood what you said, and I wanna I wanna paraphrase it back to you and get your reaction. It was something along the lines of we're you're talking about like life purpose and the purpose of life. And you said something where it was like,

Gilad

Mm-hmm.

Jeff Albaum

Because I know my life's purpose, the ups and downs are much more easy to navigate. Like I'm not, I'm not as stressed, not these exact words, but I'm not as stressed on the lows because I know what I'm here to do. And I heard that, I was like, that's fucking awesome. Like, holy smokes. So A, did I understand that correctly? And B, yeah, react to that. Like, how how did you how did you know that? How do you feel confident saying that?

Gilad

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Did I say that to Mendy?

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Gilad

Okay. So yes, I'm very lucky that I knew my life's purpose fairly early on. I didn't I wasn't always brave enough to to look it in the eye and be like, I accept this responsibility. and it's not always the case because in order for that to be true, I have to be locked in, even if it's a bad time.

Meaning like things aren't getting done or I'm not, you know, the best version of myself or life's not being super easy on me. If I'm able to kind of be like, Hey, we both know what the end result is gonna be both meaning me and myself. We both know what the end result is gonna be. Cause this is what you're here to do.

This is just another page in the autobiography. It makes things a lot easier. I remember I remember like having a couple moments where I was thinking to myself, not in those exact words, but in in like in the sense of like, this is gonna make everything that you are set out for so much more valuable, the shit you're going through right now. And that that is something like even if you don't

Yeah, kinda have it figured out as to like and I and I don't I would be the like it'd be very ignorant of me to say or assumptive to say that I know exactly what I'm put out here to do. That being said, I know when I feel aligned and I have for a very, very long time, and I know when I feel like I'm being as authentic as I can, and ninety percent of those times happen on stage.

And most of the other times happen when I'm in the writing or creative process, whether that's alone at home or in the studio. but allowing people to feel understood and heard through my personal experiences interpreted through song has made me feel the best I've ever felt. And we're not talking like a a a substance high. We're talking about an an a lasting powerful experience.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

I used to be much more like serious about this. Now it's like I rarely drink. I used to not like not a sip. and one of the reasons that I like initially started that was because I had just like started performing a little bit more consistently. And I remember like feeling like if I were ever an absent for one of these moments, like where I just like where there's no like where the entire room is present and it's as if

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Like just like everyone existed in one existence for one second, you know, in a two hour show that could happen for fifteen seconds. Sometimes it doesn't even happen at all. But when it does happen, it's undeniable for everybody who's in the room. And I thought to myself, like, if I ever miss out on one of these opportunities because I was, you know, doing something to disengage from myself, that would be unforgivable. So I I do believe that I I I have an idea or a very good idea.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm.

Gilad

Especially in comparison to most people in this day and age, a very good idea as to what I'm here for. And therefore, when when I'm going through it, usually the question of you're going through it, but are you still moving forward? Are you still acting aligned with your goals, whether those are career goals, personal goals, relationship goals, are you still acting within those things? Even if the answer is no, having asked that question will usually ease a lot of the pain because then it's easier to fix.

To fix it if if I'm not aligned. And more often than like, thank God I'm I'm like, I get to do this. Like I'm a musician. Like and I I like and and so it's like, yeah. Not every day you're writing the hit song, not every day you're you're hit hitting a streaming high. Not every day you're playing in front of the most people you're play you've ever played for in your life. Are you moving towards those goals? Are you are you are you l are you bettering yourself?

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

More often than not, the answer is yes. And when the when the answer is no, right, so get on it.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm. Make make some sort of change.

Gilad

Yeah. So I think the luckiness on in this in this sense is that I know what to be aligned to. Like it's not that I'm asking myself, is this good or bad? I'm asking myself, is this good or bad in relationship to what you what you believe is is the most truth for you or the most correct for you.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm. And I'm sure probably in those moments is maybe when creativity comes and you're in like an amazing space to write songs.

Gilad

Yeah. Yeah. I think that the thing I struggle with the most these days is being hard on myself when I'm not available to pick up a song idea. like if I'm so I I there are like two approaches that coexist in most songwriters. One is, you know, like be writing consistently, so that if inspiration hits, you know, you're you're available for it.

Jeff Albaum

Mm okay, wait, say say more. What do you mean?

Gilad

And the other is is like when inspiration hits, you act on it. Life stops.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

full transparency. there are people that have gotten last minute cancellations from me because got bit by the song bug. I'm sorry, I'm not gonna make it today. but sometimes that's just not an option. Like you were waiting three months to get your passport renewed and finally your appointment came up, and therefore you have to you have to go.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Right.

Gilad

And obviously much worse excuses than that to not write a song, that's when I get hard with myself. Cause that's like a full no. That's a full that's a full you're not aligned. You're not doing what you're supposed to be doing. You have a responsibility out here. Like I've I've I've and this is not me tooting my own hoard, I've had the privilege of having people reach out both online and offline, meaning like at shows saying, like, just so you know that I live this song. I I this song has

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Right. Right.

Gilad

you know, gotten me through divorce. This song has gotten me, like I told you earlier, my father's death. If I'm not ru if not if if my mind's not in creating the thing that can provide a similar service to service to the person who I haven't created a song for, I'm I'm I'm slacking off. I'm not doing what I'm supposed to be doing. So like if an idea presents itself to me, I get that like touch of inspiration. And I have to have to or just

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

flat out do make the decision to not address it. A, I have like a belief that I might need to work on that. I'm for sure pushing off the next time that that inspiration will come my way because it sees that it doesn't have a safe place to come to. And B, I owe that person who doesn't doesn't get the song, I owe them an apology. Like a sincere apology.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Dude, you're you're such a cool combination of taking things insanely seriously.

And maybe that's not like maybe the fact that that's

juxtaposed or maybe seemingly juxtaposed with like creativity and being like playful almost is is unique. So maybe it's maybe it's obvious that that's unique, but I th like every time I hang out with you, I'm like, you're the most serious person I know in some regards, and also the most like, I don't really know what to call it. Creative maybe, but that feels too shallow of a word. Like you take creativity extremely seriously.

Gilad

Well it's silly.

Yeah. I try to. I think that it's like first of all, I I I think that everyone is creative. I think that everyone is musical, by the way, to a certain extent. I think that I've heard too many people say they were tone deaf or you know, like or or like that that just aren't. You can hear by the internet by the way they speak that they're not. I have met people who are, but they are like few. There are so few of them.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Who really can't tell the difference between someone yelling and someone speaking. Everything sounds monotonic to them. There are people like that, but at that, like they're the exception, not the people who are musically inclined. I take I take created creativity seriously. for a couple reasons. I think that there there is also an element of me like being a little hard on myself, and want and and definitely want to be better about that. But

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Right, right.

Gilad

Thank God, like I was given something that fills me up to the brim. And I've and I've known what that thing is since day one. I was bringing my electric guitar and amplifier, walking like twenty minutes to school so that in recess I could plug it in and play for an extra, you know, whatever, you know, how long recess was that day.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Gilad

Like that's how much I love this stuff. And there are people who are able to generate generations of wealth by doing that. There are. And they're not only the A listers that we that we're all familiar with. It's an industry, just like any other industry. There are there there there's money to be made there. And if I wanna if I wanna a create wealth for myself and and my future kids and my future wife and

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And my parents and and and family who I wanna kinda look after. And I also got something that can clearly influence people for the better, meaning I have to get it out to as many people as possible, meaning I have to be creating both in volume and and quality. So if I if I kind of snooze on that and be like, well, it'll happen when it happens, and it's being a little irresponsible.

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

You see it as like a like you're you're a steward almost.

Gilad

It it's my it's I th I I I think it's kind of my obligation. Like if you were told that you had j just like by the way, just like it was Oppenheimer's job to build the first atomic bomb.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

All right. He whether it was a bomb or a reactor or whatever, he took the world to a new day and age. He moved humanity forward. Some people would argue for better, some people would argue for worse. Same could be said for John Lennon. You know, his the his songs changed people's lives for the better. His subliminal messages may have changed a lot of people's lives for the worse.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

If you know what you're

Jeff Albaum

Wait, what were his subliminal messages that that people didn't like?

Gilad

Well, he was he he so he was like first of all, the fact that he was like kind of preaching hippie equality, socialism and things like that, and the fac and he was probably one of the richest people on planet Earth in his day and age. Like he w he was he was like a commune member leading a super capitalist life. he was very violent with his partners up until Yoko Ono. He was a terrible father to his first son, arguably, allegedly.

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Gilad

there was a lot there was a lot wrong with him, and just like there's a lot wrong with everyone, but like if you know what you're good at. I'm a firm believer that if you're good at something, it's because you know, whoever is making all the plans has plans for you to do that thing to better the world you were given, so that when you leave it, it's a better place. All right, and we're not perfect and we leave.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

You know, we leave a bit of a mess sometimes and dirty dishes in the sink. But like all like all in all, like that's it's also very Jewish belief. Letakeno Lambi Marchadai. The reason we're here is to, you know, would make the world a better place. And if you're given a gift, if that's mathematics or if that's music or if that's running so fast that it inspires people, like look at the Olympics. I think the Olympics is incredible soccer.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

People wrote columns on Messi sitting on the grass after losing yesterday. Columns about what a competitor. And you've given us the best lesson of all, showing how to lose gracefully after after a cr like all these incredible things. It's like he's kicking a ball. And it's easy to kind of roll your eyes and be like, he's kicking a ball. He's giving people hope. Like people actually learn a lot about themselves by engaging with these insane competitors.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Gilad

Both on the spiritual and mental and also on the physical level. Like, why does the world care if a four minute mile was broken? Cause it matters. 'Cause w cause we have put we have now pushed what we thought was humanly possible.

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Right. Right.

Gilad

So if you're given a gift and you don't act upon it like think of the world without Usain Bolt or Michael Phelps or John Lennon or or Oppenheimer or Einstein Einstein. Like these are like the world's a better place because of them.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Dude, I love that. I love that framing. I don't think I I haven't I don't know if I've heard that before or if I haven't just internalized it before, but I really love that framing. I really love that framing. What would you what? Yeah? Yeah. I guess you you might not have a reaction to this, and that's totally fine. But like I don't know. I think in today's day and age it's really hard to f

Gilad

It it's a relatively new one.

For me. Yeah, it's a relative new one new one for me.

Jeff Albaum

Find your I think a lot of people don't know their purpose, right? If you ask them that question, they'd be like, Shit, man, I don't know. What would you tell them? What would you tell your your niece or nephew who says, I don't know. I don't know what I'm here do.

Gilad

Mm-hmm.

so first of all, I would say that if smartphones existed when I first started learning music, there's a good chance that I wouldn't know. I think that we live in a world that's so good at distracting people, that the the things that had to take place in order for me to realize how much I love consuming and creating music might not have might not have happened at all.

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Gilad

You know, like think of think if my dad had taken me to a show and just like so many kids you see these days, I'd be sitting next to him on the chair with my phone in front of me like this. And thinking to myself, Are we done yet? There's a good chance that I would have never experienced that. And if we were in the car and my dad was going, Hey, can you hear the drums and I have and I'm have to take out an AirPod and be like, What? What'd you say? It's a good chance that I that I wouldn't love music the way I do right now. So

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Okay.

Gilad

A that B is I think that the question itself, what is my purpose is

It's like asking a friend for advice.

Not because you want advice, but because you you want to relieve yourself of the responsibility of of coming up with the answer. Like I and I'm sure you agree with you agree with me on this because you you like I I know how I know how you think, but like or I I've known you for a while, so I I feel like I feel confident in what I say, but like you might know this this may have happened to you, but like sometimes you'll ask for help.

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Gilad

And you know like you know that it there can be like maybe three answers and you probably know all of them. You just wanna know which one whoever you're asking advice from is going to is gonna point at you.

As opposed to like taking the risk of of giving yourself advice and fucking it up.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Gilad

So you're gonna try and like make sure, even though your friend's advice might go as sideways as anything you might have done, but in a way, then your friend gave you bad advice. And then it's not like really, then then I'm not then I'm then then I'm not stupid. I didn't mess it up, which by the way is just a like j the way I said that just goes to show how hard I I can be on myself and why I would seek help externally as opposed to looking inward.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah.

Yeah, no, totally, totally.

Gilad

But like

he so like maybe getting up from that kind of a fall doesn't hurt as much because I'm not like it's not real like I fell, but like it wasn't my fault. Yeah. Then you might take action a little slower next time because it still was a failure, even though it wasn't your own, but you know, you didn't trust yourself the first time. You trusted yourself to trust someone else, and that didn't work out.

Jeff Albaum

It wasn't my fault. I I got that advice.

Yeah, that's interesting.

Right. Right.

Gilad

So I th so circling back to like so someone who like wants to know what their purpose is, follow your heart, man. I can't say this like with with enough heart. And that's not a like, you know, listen to the wind. It's like the thing that this really stops us from doing is asking ourselves, what do I want? You don't ask you don't if if you were constantly asking yourself

what I want, then your Instagram feed would be

So different than what it is because what it is right now is you're like you're being fed things as opposed to searching what you want to see. Like you have an algorithm, it prevent it provides things for you and it has a goal. It has its goal is to keep you there and you know, have more of your attention. So if it gives you only what you want, what you actually want, and not what's comfortable to see, you know, like seeing another.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

like comedians clip or to see, you know, in the good case scenario, comedians clip and some guitarist. Like God knows what the like what what what Instagram and TikTok you know bring up to your feed. But like, so I would say turn this thing off and say yourself, if my phone were to burn down, what would I want to do today? And if that if the answer to that is go to Barton Springs and hop in the spring and go for a swim, you go to Barton Springs, you hop in for a swim.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

And and like utilize your free time to to ask yourself that kind of stuff, and usually it'll lead you somewhere where you're like, damn, I didn't see myself having such a good time. I imagine what will happen at Barton Springs either the first, second, or third time, is you'll bump into someone who happens to be doing some sort of activity that you wouldn't have considered doing, but it sounds cool after the way he described it. And you that's how things happen. You going, you you telling yours like,

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Gilad

And this is a controversial thing, but like both men and women, if you ask a guy or a girl what they're looking for in a partner, a single person, and then you ask them, okay, and now show me your 10 previous partners.

There's usually not a lot to do with what they say they want and what it turns out they actually want, meaning their track record. And that's because we've kind of been trained to say what we want to want. You see it in musicians who who want to want to listen to specific kinds of music because it would enrich them musically, but really they're suckers for Taylor Swift, which is great. It's good music. But like they're like

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

We we often when we're asked what we want, we tell people what we want to want, what we think would be good for us to want. Right? So like you like I I've had we have a mutual acquaintance, a dear friend, like I I think she's a dear friend of yours as well, who will clearly tell you that she wants a sensitive, soft-spoken, liberal. Like there are a bunch of like

Jeff Albaum

Right, right, right.

Gilad

things that she wants. And most of them will be, you know, like these like sensitive, good listener. And de facto she's dated like frat bros. Like just frat bros.

Jeff Albaum

Okay.

Gilad

And that's okay. And sh she there's a good chance she doesn't even notice the dissonance between the two. But what she says she wants is actually what she wishes she wants.

Jeff Albaum

Right.

Right, right, right, right. That's so interesting. I'm trying to like think and go through like an audit of my life and like what I say I want versus what I if that if that's also true. It's kinda my it's kinda trippy.

Jeff Albaum

It's what?

No no you're good, you're fuck.

God damn it.

I just hope we I hope uploaded everything.

Gilad

So so I think Yeah, yeah. It says an hour and seven minutes here, so it must be all things included. So what I was saying what I was saying is that the reason I brought up our our dear friend and what she wants to want as opposed to what she actually wants is I think the question, what is my purpose, is is the similar question like what are you looking for in a guy? Whereas in what you're actually drawn to in a person is discovered through trial and error.

Jeff Albaum

nice, okay. Okay, cool.

Hm.

Gilad

Like there ha there has to be an like an idea of premeditation and like what what you're looking for, but there's also like just attraction. And those things are that are not value based, that are that are chemistry based, that are that are interpersonally based. Those things are learned through experience. And the same thing has to be said for like purposes or what what we want to be doing with our life. What do you want what do you do for a living? What do you want to do for a living? So I think that.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

Asking yourself constantly the question, what do I want to do? Is this what I want to do? Is this what I want to do? It's taking you out of the moment. Whereas in just doing stuff, like asking yourself, what do I want to do? that that, great. I'm I'm getting in the car, going to Barton Springs, sending three messages out. Hey, you want to join me at Barton Springs? That's what I want to do. That's that's focusing on being present. And then when you're present and you get really good at being pleasant, present, then you can go, hmm. This is for me. This isn't for me.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And just kind of noticing how where you feel going back to your original conversation of like aligned. Like where you feel alignment.

Gilad

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah. Yeah, that's really that's really interesting, man. I don't know. I think I've told you we we did our silent meditation retreat. No input for seven days.

Gilad

A vi piapassana?

Jeff Albaum

It wasn't. It it was actually a Jewish one. It was like a like a Jew boo vibe. it was awesome. Yeah. and it was I had never done anything like that before. But like no phone, no input, no sound, no talking. And then coming back into the world was such a weird

Gilad

Mm.

Jubu.

Jeff Albaum

mind F because like just like listening to a song, talk about music, dude, like you have that input and it's like this sensory overload. You're like, whoa. Like I listened to Red Hot Chili Peppers, which was one of favorite bands, and it was like I had to turn it off. I was like, it's this is too much right now. Like this is insane. You know, like

Gilad

That's also that's over that's overload on on on normal standards. Coming off of a seven day silence retreat, that ps that'll put you over.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, I was like I can't and like I was driving at the same time. So you had like traffic coming and lights and billboards and I was like whoa.

Gilad

When when did you do that?

Jeff Albaum

That was January of twenty twenty five. So last last January. but same thing, like no f no phones and like you you have it's not boredom because that's not the right word for it, but like you you your your body

finds interest in the smallest of things and you start noticing stuff and you're like, the way that like that breeze moves that leaf is like unbelievable. You know, like you find like such immense joy in that tiny thing.

Gilad

But that is boredom and I think boredom has only recently become a like a bad thing. Something that people are scared of. But like that's you have to be bored. You have to be bored. It's so important. It's a lost art to be bored.

Jeff Albaum

Right, right.

Right. Right.

Literally. Yeah. Yeah. I mean dude, all the all the like the digital detox stuff, you know, every time I see that I I laugh. 'Cause I'm like, this has actually been figured out for thousands and thousands of years. Like in every major religion, you take a day off.

Gilad

There's a there's

Yeah. No, but but not only not taking a day off. Like th there's a a comedian, I don't remember his name, but he's a middle aged guy in New York and he's hilarious. And one of his things he talks about is like everyone's talking about being present. It's like there used to be no place to be but in the present. You'd sit on a bus and you'd watch you'd watch the air conditioning drip onto the seat in front of you for however long the ride was gonna be. That's just

Jeff Albaum

Right.

Gilad

That's that's all there was. And we weren't born in that. Like maybe we were born at the very end of that generation where that existed. But even then you had people with like walkmans, like listening to CDs on their headphones on the bus. You had a paper if you wanted to read it. And there was probably a time that probably there was a time where there wasn't even that, but for hundreds of years, like you had a paper and you you you'd read the paper a little bit, you get up, you'd walk around, you'd have a cup of tea, you sit down.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

There are people till today in this very country who sit on their porch from the second they finish work until the sun goes down.

And just look into the sunset. Like there are people that do that. And and we just we've been conditioned to need so many distractions.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, it's the it's the negative side of the of the positive side being able to learn anything.

Gilad

Yeah. Yeah. And and the thing is is I think it like I think society will this the pendulum might swing back in a way. Like I think like here's a good example and this may be more personal than it is a fact, but like I've I've worked with kids who are better at limiting their electronics time than my parents.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm. Really?

Gilad

Yeah. I think they kind of

It's it's this like awareness that like, you know, posture coaches will tell you that the first thing that you need to focus on when you're trying to better your posture is that slouching isn't comfortable. You have to internalize that, you have to understand it. You have to you have to be that, you have to be uncomfortable slouching. Even though slouching is the product of trying to make yourself work less and be therefore more comfortable.

You don't have to work your back muscles to to slouch. That's everything sits when you stack your stomach muscles on top of each other.

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Gilad

So it's the same with with with these kids who I think they just kinda like because they were born into it and this is not something of the future, like for our parents, this is this is the future. There were movies when they were teenagers suggesting that there would be something like this, and it was almost like laughable.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

So for them it's like this is, you know, this is the future. For kids it's like it's a phone.

That's what I think. I think that like I think the pendulum will swing back in terms of that.

Jeff Albaum

Dude, I don't

That that's interesting. I I'm I'm curious to see. I think of all the interactions I've had with the young dude, we're like not that old. We're too we're too young to be having the conversation of the younger generation. that being said, all the interactions I've had y yeah, that doesn't feel I don't know. Of all the interactions I've had with the younger generations, every time I've had an interaction with them, I have walked away being so unbelievably impressed and just thinking, like, when I was your age, like

Gilad

The younger generation. We're thirty. We're thirty.

Jeff Albaum

We're gonna be fine. Like the future is awesome. Like, if you guys are the the future, like we are we're cruising, we're chilling. This is amazing.

Gilad

Yeah.

Hundred percent.

Jeff Albaum

And that's a really fun I don't know, I just get I get fired up. I get fired up thinking about like, yeah, pe like college students in today's day and age, that like they're like they're just so I feel like more hard working and driven, but also like understanding their feelings and internalizing them and like being like, Hey, I need to go over there and just knowing themselves so much better. I'm like, this is it's amazing.

Gilad

Agreed. No, it's very impressive to watch. And the reason the reason I say the younger generation and feel comfortable saying that is because people are adulting much younger, both physically and mentally. I do believe that like I can talk about like my friend groups and and the younger friend groups from where I grew up where like kids who were five, six years younger than us were doing things that we were doing

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

at a certain age they were doing them at a much younger age, whether that was the way they were rebelling or the way they saw fit to party and the way they were maturing. And like there's that side of it. Yeah, I it just it I'm not like I I'm with you. I'm not worried about about the future. I think that the ki the when I say the younger generation, I what I mean is people who don't know what it what it's like to not have a smartphone. You and I both remember that.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah. Yeah.

Gilad

Or to not have an a an always accessible computer screen. Like you and I you and I know of that time where like it was either play outside or plop yourself down in front of whatever's on on TV, which was also like depending on the family, like some like my parents very much tried to limit how much, you know, my sister and I were in front of screens and and did pretty well. Like I was outside quite a bit. like

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Right, right.

Gilad

So we remember that kids who were born after the year two thousand and one, two thousand and two, by the time they were in first or second grade,

Everyone had an iPhone.

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

It's different world.

Jeff Albaum

Totally. Totally.

So what's next for you? Bogey. What's what are you working on?

Gilad

Bulgy. so I'm I'm in the final stages of releasing a two-part album. It's split up into two EPs, which are just short albums, titled New Shit Volume One and Two. shit spelled SH exclamation point T. first one was released in June of last year. Second

is almost done being released. I've been releasing them one single at a time. Second one will be fully released this coming September. I'm constantly engaging in writing my next album. What I think it's I think it's gonna be called Late Bloomer. I something I something I I I like very much about that name. and in June in August

Jeff Albaum

Mm-hmm.

Gilad

This coming August, I'm going to go to Nashville to do a few writing sessions with some very, very talented and very highly regarded songwriters, which I'm very excited about. And in September, I'm going to be opening a couple of shows for an incredible artist named MT Jones. He's coming in from the UK. I think he's doing like like thirty or forty shows here in the US. So I'm gonna be opening a couple of his shows for him, which is super exciting. Super, super exciting.

And yeah, I think it's probably gonna be right after that that I decide to hop back into the studio to start to stop writing for a second and start recording this next album.

Jeff Albaum

Okay. Okay. Okay. Well how can if people want to find out more about you, where can they where can they do that?

Gilad

so it would be bogey music on Instagram, B-O-G-E-E music. No spaces, no dots or anything. on Instagram, bogey, b-o-g-e-e on Spotify. bogeymusic.com is my personal website. and if anyone wanted to get in touch with me directly, I think Instagram would be the best bet. if someone wants to support me in a cost free way.

on my website, bogeymusic.com. If you scroll to the bottom, you can sign up for my mailing list. And all that I to have a have a mailing list for is to know what city people who are tuning into my music live in. And therefore, if you sign up for my email list and I see that I have, you know, thirty people in Seattle, I'll immediately email those people in Seattle and be like, hey, I want to come do a show for you guys. You interested? And and then I'll go to Seattle for a show.

Jeff Albaum

Mm.

Gilad

There will be no marketing, no like, and and this is what Gilly's gil bogey's been up to for the past, you know, week. Like n there's none of that. If there's a show, people who are in my mailing list will know about a show near them. Cetou, as they say in French. For the

Jeff Albaum

Is there a mailing list for people who do wanna know what's up with you what you're doing on a weekly basis?

Gilad

Honestly, yeah, I I sh I I should probably be better about that, but at the moment there isn't. But Instagram Instagram is like a is like a what's going on list, I guess.

Jeff Albaum

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dude, you're you're a beast. Thank you so much for for doing this. I appreciate you, man.

Gilad

Thank you so much for having me. It's it w I don't get to see enough of you, so at least in this in this context.

Jeff Albaum

A hundred percent. I know we we we need to do one in person. We will do one in person.

Gilad

A hundred percent. We will. We will. We will.

Jeff Albaum

Alright. Thank you so much, Elada. Appreciate you. Bye, everybody. I love you too.

Gilad

Love you, my man. Bye bye.